Player is loading...
Land (and soil?) management in the Flemish fringe around Brussels
Luc Van der Elst, program coordinator and project manager, Vlaamse Landmaatschappij
Thursday, Feb. 27, 2020 · 4:40 p.m. · 31m 15s
Embed
Transcriptions
Note: this content has been automatically generated.
00:00:00
when we talk about management they are yeah uh
00:00:06
talk one talker i tried to talk about so imminent
00:00:09
emphasis was asked some guy with my best for uh
00:00:17
anyway it's also always atlanta mentions yeah you'd have
00:00:22
to keep pace with them in the fringe and losses
00:00:26
which are being forced his face to connect them to change the page has remember
00:00:33
right if you were climates we try to create removable
00:00:38
uh and a pleasant high quality plans to do okay
00:00:45
no problem i have to explain well the uh
00:00:49
flemish french just had a especially to our uh
00:00:53
once in geneva ah for ah information and and yeah
00:00:58
it has the end of project manager or for the
00:01:00
french french or under the nineteen president of this round brussels
00:01:05
uh and farmers so just have my longest we should also have writing responses from
00:01:13
so ah she's nineteen uh are considered as being the the flemish french
00:01:23
that's not good some numbers but that a flemish that's uh about
00:01:28
forty eight activists the and this more than four hundred thousand inhabitants
00:01:35
yeah that's excessive does have the facilities for the french speaking what happens
00:01:40
one seven sure about the sixth and seventh i this is just an agricultural lands
00:01:46
and then have okay okay okay okay okay it's open space it's that
00:01:51
seven percent of mentions because it's the period in region
00:01:56
so and the the averaging flaunt assisted three
00:02:00
persons in the french spanish changes a lot higher
00:02:04
the hard surfaces also hard and foremost i think there's lots of fourteen
00:02:09
and the room was a small village in uh one of the nineteen uh
00:02:15
in the flemish changes the the worst their own uh that method
00:02:20
it doesn't ah okay by the us there's if i if a person and also has a fifty trips
00:02:27
every day you use uh about three thousand square meters
00:02:32
of uh open space so one actor okay for me
00:02:37
and we are number one in your in hours last into
00:02:45
yeah there's also a a
00:02:49
some difference it's not a homogeneous stages so the
00:02:54
martin versus or still semi rural oh well because in west or more some
00:03:00
of them is the brussels we formed a morse densely populated service for this unit
00:03:06
and some of them got washed lots of uh industry also and ah industry and
00:03:13
business that they are uh in the neighbourhood of the of the uh it worked
00:03:20
which is a logical think besides uh of losses on the much more pressure because and
00:03:28
also some of the the the university town uh uh so the pressure comes from both sides
00:03:35
yeah small honestly thought this that's i've i've got this place and make and try and they
00:03:41
have a very uh i uh i average
00:03:44
for inheritance for instance reason because uh uh uh
00:03:49
an average of two thousand two hundred which uh have a inheritance
00:03:53
this where you are which is nothing in comparison to me of course
00:03:58
yeah for us it's even more than that
00:04:05
in this out is to find the more residential uh was that i guess that
00:04:09
would find most of the experts and a you know a a which you inhabitants
00:04:18
uh in this region we yeah i uh arises and rising region based we
00:04:25
set our first that's in management since since the that says it doesn't seven
00:04:30
and we extended process in two thousand and two thousand fourteen
00:04:35
and uh and into don't for being the flemish
00:04:38
government decided to uh have the whole area as the
00:04:43
project for and that's fine so now we have ninety minutes that is where we can work on a space
00:04:50
we uh yeah go so that a lot of work was so you
00:04:53
have a lot of what what state which results with special plan us
00:04:58
more than mine the meetings with the communities seven is this a movie is
00:05:03
a big buttons of the french governments and so i also think was interests
00:05:11
ah what was you this new off was forgotten before where you're from
00:05:21
yeah so uh on that basis we made a most one uh and we say we
00:05:26
rode out that lance and we may also probably work for a popular version of it
00:05:32
for the moment we have a eleven projects uh uh going only the television
00:05:37
french uh for each of them from austin plan ah was being made up
00:05:42
hello almost each plan uh consists of several miles where it's from
00:05:47
yeah our capacity of a full time equivalents uh is
00:05:51
no of fully planned to two thousand and twenty four
00:05:55
okay them by the time we will have invested forty million euro which uh from
00:06:01
the from the new government in open space was nine mister that is an issue comes
00:06:06
uh the uh contributions of apartments will be in in
00:06:11
total more than the main room for space him yeah
00:06:17
so why is it that we go from a a lot of man
00:06:21
you was small uh a larger scale to small scale uh
00:06:26
on no less you can see a small uh most one
00:06:32
but also those small all the land consist of you
00:06:35
can is is being re fright in several a small rats
00:06:41
so every of those being carried out a separate
00:06:49
before we carry out up nicely consults uh the inhabitants uh
00:06:55
mostly two times uh at least ten times almost three times before we used on the kerry yeah it's
00:07:04
uh we have for several instances though to fulfil
00:07:08
to carry out our rounds uh for wrong for instance
00:07:13
uh we combine grounds we can work with the i don't know it's
00:07:17
right to round badge i suppose everyone understands it's happened with its life
00:07:24
hi
00:07:27
so for for uh we can also swung problems with
00:07:31
private persons we can uh was lower than with municipalities wednesdays
00:07:35
we can for the use of browns because what rules of downs so there's a lot of what we
00:07:43
uh when we use that land in order of projects them the flemish them based uh she is
00:07:49
a problem with it is also the the over
00:07:52
fifty cents big are also really what a grounds
00:07:58
an uh an atlanta logical slop or two that's available in some
00:08:03
cases or in some areas like english or so's right of preemption
00:08:08
ah and then uh all rounds that uh are being sold in the uh it can be
00:08:15
first walls by definition and it is they were quite was that last night ross isn't too high
00:08:22
uh uh at least not higher than the average
00:08:27
um another instrument that it's a it's a new instant also is the right of preference
00:08:34
um the whole like public owners of lance of rounds uh we
00:08:39
want to sell their that has to operate first to the flowers
00:08:44
so we are first also why
00:08:50
other instruments uh to relax or social and
00:08:54
or a a good system so this is um
00:08:59
to realise how lance and is of course one can you hold sorry
00:09:13
you're getting out of the a lot of works interviews that this uh our core business
00:09:19
we can rearrange open space by building you writing or a walking wells but opening rivers
00:09:26
that what you didn't in the seventies and by creating playgrounds but taking it project managers
00:09:32
rearranging relations on effect what we do if you uh
00:09:38
if you the files should say monthly is uh to uh
00:09:44
root beer the mistakes of the seventies anyway um
00:09:50
especially when someone management um bought was uh the flemish government base uh that's
00:09:57
consistent with those look works and the problems involved greater yeah the t. v.
00:10:04
you know but didn't make it was not just possible possible on prime longitudinal signpost services locally
00:10:12
one then of course one of gets a an a contribution for uh
00:10:19
the levels of u. c. has in stuff
00:10:22
compensation i would also convinced convinced farm farmers who
00:10:27
agreed upon ever an actual environmental matters agreements
00:10:32
and also those ones won't give the financial troubles
00:10:37
and we can finally condensate financially for the limits of services that is
00:10:43
mostly after work so well for me it's a k. l.
00:10:50
and then one last set of instruments we have is
00:10:52
a fascinating the project the instrument to facilitate the projects
00:10:58
oh we get reimbursed anyone can not or doesn't want to use of problems and anymore
00:11:05
for instance when when we need to watch uh uh
00:11:08
of of things do look we got it flooded the
00:11:12
from time to time than a than a former clinton
00:11:17
say uh uh the uh the the yeah so ah
00:11:24
okay the government needs to take measures on for instance a form there are several possibilities
00:11:30
the former can judge that it is impossible and we're to
00:11:33
his phone interviews we and he can uh also financial compensation
00:11:38
we can do so one eventually stops his uh for me
00:11:43
going verses for ah or voluntarily wants to move to another place
00:11:49
we can start farming in in an area that is fit for for i ah when
00:11:55
different governmental measures come together and and make
00:11:59
it impossible for for to to continue for me
00:12:03
should be able to then he can uh get that can
00:12:07
ask you can you can uh falsely governments and why not
00:12:12
um
00:12:15
finally we can work also with the uh uh we wins and those are smaller measures that
00:12:21
fits completely you know less but that can be carried out of assume that by what other options
00:12:28
uh and in that case we pay a fifty percent slips
00:12:33
now these instruments or um uh the dating from two
00:12:38
thousand and fourteen and not all of them or uh
00:12:44
have have we didn't have we don't have them uh in fact it's over at the moment but
00:12:51
we are all them in uh oh plans for the future the green ones
00:12:56
you use for men so very often the red ones are still a ah
00:13:04
justin there we don't have much experience on raw thrust of this
00:13:13
yeah not a used very often though so we can like big experience it's there's
00:13:21
management is the great wasn't living and working conditions but in the meantime we
00:13:27
tried to take a tackle some problems uh like something like i liked billy
00:13:37
well my son landscapes
00:13:41
she's one of the process if you ever come i can show you some uh landscapes she wanted
00:13:48
or ah like uh various uh there's a lot
00:13:51
of uh a real waste a reverse of canals
00:13:58
highways going off to learn from brussels and they're all barriers for uh
00:14:04
a convertible and uh or transfer
00:14:10
oh oh so now quickly some of our results until
00:14:13
now it's uh this is the masses flat and often on
00:14:17
a smaller scale for a park and there isn't a livable the course of a few in uh and the need for
00:14:27
this is the part before the bands with great out get out because the
00:14:33
half the house in the background as a as a reference point he says oh
00:14:40
what is the same thing with the nest next one red
00:14:43
houses are a useful reference points and it's it's you slide off
00:14:51
so here in this one this is an overall view uh in this uh well we we yeah
00:14:59
the next the capacity to stop what else is six thousand cubic meters
00:15:04
but we also installs a an ecological long something written business you will was
00:15:11
thought some uh is it does so uh the ecosystem services are much higher than this
00:15:20
hardly notice that marcus that's true
00:15:26
'kay
00:15:29
another one uh which enables the rice from the
00:15:34
flemish foster and and uh it's the fork sane in uh on them
00:15:41
and so with the uh several options of production about this
00:15:46
part of several functions as you can see uh that was
00:15:51
'kay park uh you'd go back uh then it's not a
00:15:55
football club for the association and lots of housing and the mean
00:16:02
so during the meeting we don't what was that one was already find you and uh
00:16:08
but difference as long as it's a possibility to work
00:16:11
to do block running or fitness alumnus analysis was gone
00:16:16
but we get the woodman exploding with for for instance you see on the right
00:16:23
the uh tennis uh come up uh agree each to uh
00:16:28
uh the place a tennis which would five meters of it will uh
00:16:34
and the working class e. g.
00:16:41
and to get from your original view of the new york below had to convince
00:16:47
that's always a problem is that when it does it will uh this one
00:16:53
so we had a a lot of uh consulting we
00:16:56
organised the together with managed but between moments of intense actions
00:17:01
oh it's actually happens the first one one for most uses one
00:17:07
ah the work a lot of concerns uh discussed
00:17:12
that first evening safety than walking possible this autumn management
00:17:17
ah and or concerns were translated into the plan but
00:17:21
but leaving the hamptons also have the opportunity to this site
00:17:25
whether ah streets that got walking to not have this is the
00:17:32
ah this we're uh is all all evening long people
00:17:36
get got a lot of information but often right the uh
00:17:40
whatever uh we had some workshops where uh we could decide one
00:17:45
of these three possibilities the first the first option was to keep the
00:17:49
rule that was that we also mean that the car traffic to walk
00:17:53
with the main thing in a second option the remote would disappear completely
00:17:59
there would only be a possibility if like us
00:18:02
this chance to go to work and or gain space
00:18:07
and that option was that show up to slow down traffic but visual overall missions
00:18:14
to our surprise even a seven of the age
00:18:17
groups choose for option two uh hence the probably the
00:18:23
a mayor and is uh uh the shah fell on
00:18:32
right they were all their uh and they uh well uh suppresses
00:18:37
we were just for you chose for uh the rating down the road
00:18:42
so the realistically it now and the message from my question that this this is not it's
00:18:49
it's uh it's the beginning of the do rose this is one of
00:18:53
um this is the rules are left you see the level of uh
00:18:59
uh recitals and on the uh a light sleeper them off for
00:19:06
this but yeah offices we begin when i i'm a referral to work
00:19:16
and this is the role that one to to walk to the park so
00:19:19
this is the style or a possible for five years and uh uh if she
00:19:28
we don't believe that one also this last example for real early
00:19:34
sometimes it's of that we make an explain plan and uh stuff so this is the
00:19:39
uh this was very often the will of the tubing and stuff it works in this
00:19:49
and with us we made a plan to bring it to the surface as much as possible
00:19:55
uh and we
00:20:00
get out the small well that helps us so uh
00:20:08
only that watch we get a lot of stuff
00:20:11
and then we know that which will go into effect and several of the or
00:20:17
has the opportunity to carry out one part of the bill let's say that we have
00:20:22
for us the ace of me to get a a a big difference from the
00:20:30
yeah this is one of the of the of the landscape that but that's not
00:20:34
the but it can also the uh what should we missed that is that while she
00:20:42
you go
00:20:44
so now we have some uh oh successes but there are still some challenges that being the news
00:20:54
we we have to say when you fly was just first
00:20:58
with problems that was not really exactly seven uh with a renewed
00:21:03
yeah there are new shopping malls enron was well they're being for the whole thing
00:21:10
will the will of the year or the which will be in most
00:21:15
of the words are lots of onto the floor that question ah ha
00:21:23
there are still some other challenges for open space in total as i said we just doesn't uh twenty million
00:21:29
euro what we will be interesting uh we will have
00:21:33
investment with with the killing the new version of phase
00:21:38
is that much now compared to what one of investing accommodate
00:21:42
left business mobility the that that's et cetera it might be it's
00:21:47
and as you can see you challenged the pressure on the flag patch but nevertheless
00:21:52
we are certain that the last ten years we
00:21:55
improved the space the little and work and environments sorry
00:22:01
ah we surely if reinforce this costs open space i think
00:22:06
uh that that is left in these ninety minutes that is that we got soul
00:22:11
and use solar and there are some challenges that are difficult to
00:22:17
oh do you okay and i don't know
00:22:22
now are only eight of those challenges uh uh
00:22:29
discuss each of them so uh we can go maybe a little people in that i haven't
00:22:38
speculation i know it's a i think everyone knows how it worked
00:22:42
one of the biggest problem in this variable region is a speculation people and remote those why people yeah
00:22:49
because the thing that one day given it to
00:22:52
build the or something from by the very high rise
00:22:58
and the upstart very often the mobile use on that a bit
00:23:03
east i only uh as far by driving or financial uh_huh game
00:23:11
yeah i you don't want all of this the speculation in in this area
00:23:16
or do you value of the dollar developer this is a little in the mountains
00:23:22
ah project developer owns more than fee for the actors of lance
00:23:26
really this i go through every uh uh uh uh that and
00:23:33
as michael like engine it was as a as a shell the but they
00:23:39
they the walls of the bounce we already tried to wind and uh to to
00:23:46
mm though she actually don't identity you you've used to sell them because they he
00:23:51
opened up one day and get it uh it will be able to do it
00:24:00
so although it is admitted to area and
00:24:03
special planning maps and they still the destination
00:24:08
the old that and for almost double what price that for i think that's a that's a very
00:24:18
another problem as ah the question about traditional agriculture
00:24:24
versus social shane a one as i said one little glass in the french
00:24:30
range is a negative news but we don't manage in a room front for
00:24:38
the thought wow from you people attention clients workers that's
00:24:44
whose inhabitants to reach that our interests every day um
00:24:52
fall falsify themselves in a straight jacket billboard
00:24:56
grounded and money people big machinery and so on
00:24:59
and we often see no other possibility bank of the great very large scale especially for export
00:25:06
those farmers and that's the last night so it in ah was one
00:25:13
i've even a hundred or two hundred back that we can release
00:25:18
um for most to sell their products at home or directly on the market that person's cancer five years but
00:25:27
see the for more than a for hua celsius and just those persons in the
00:25:35
she gets changes landed getting uh in the market rear um
00:25:41
that i see the a bigger uh mow a direction for those
00:25:53
but for the formosa who will work on a small scale a
00:25:59
lot more difficult by find uh find them less and less mm gift
00:26:07
i don't know about church problem uh concerning shortly that's the different views
00:26:16
uh that and uh what was meant to be a the intended use of so there's not always much
00:26:24
here uh they're also would thought this is here is the
00:26:29
reading area on a planning a math flannel to come out
00:26:36
green green and major one carrier but be areas and i get i approach see
00:26:50
or something we are a very often come from
00:26:54
this privacy lots of people are afraid of probably use of land
00:27:01
they often even the the public land we use what i think
00:27:06
especially if you will not liking boston private property are very much it's
00:27:14
yeah they use us as safety and a c. e. o. k.
00:27:24
oh
00:27:27
or is it a person some processing people often not able to do that
00:27:31
between the value of saul in natural uh yes i have to carry us agricultural areas as well
00:27:37
they often compare with former price the thing in a different area or lance walked by well the then it's
00:27:44
uh would increase the the average average price thingy a good example of these uh
00:27:51
over pricing a overpriced there is the bunches and
00:27:54
bunches of agricultural land by worse also was high school
00:27:59
bit by agricultural land at very high prices and all the people in the neighbourhood and
00:28:07
uh take over those devices that it's our because it see that's the price you know
00:28:17
then we have got the priority for economy and mobility and we get the same effect when
00:28:24
land is needed for economic or mobility these people
00:28:28
are what are called expropriated at higher prices stuff
00:28:35
how how is the very uh special word here postage and blackmailing
00:28:41
that's also a problem i have to buy or to uh
00:28:46
we'll get a hold of grant you need it is strange don't really use in
00:28:51
this county but the very much like what you see here a chain of buttons
00:28:57
we wanted to use some of these bombs the back what the management unfolding in the whole area
00:29:03
but when we negotiated by the bones someone actually in
00:29:07
the sale of the off to all the advantages they
00:29:10
wanted to get from the ministry that the province gone
00:29:15
it's like doing so they have that as a hostage
00:29:20
although they had no glass with a consensus finally we're i'll explain it it's
00:29:29
and then uh the last one i think there are more with it
00:29:35
i think this is an of a fruitful discussion
00:29:38
you a fee for consequences office in in every uh
00:29:44
some people don't want to sell their land because they are afraid of what the uh will happen often stay
00:29:50
and then we don't only mean uh that they are worried about the measures that they
00:29:57
yeah that is also of course also concern but in this area for
00:30:02
instance we had planned of making a large park discovered the missus but the
00:30:08
the former didn't want to says that even though you know you know which the the the
00:30:14
right part was not use him as you can see you know that was based in the back
00:30:21
and we are pretty sure they yeah some garbage no they're in this case before
00:30:25
she he was afraid you might find out that and you know what the study and
00:30:31
finally we want to go over and after about four years what
00:30:37
she she
00:30:41
you can see the little so often give us some difficulty it cause a certainty now
00:30:47
projects and prevent us from time to time that we cannot rearrange open spaces we like
00:30:54
the tension between private and public interest cause delays were ups
00:30:58
let's let's let's look at the you know it's it's got off
Conference Program
Introduction
Roselyne de Lestrange & Panos Mantziaras
Feb. 27, 2020 · 4 p.m.
477 views
Du bon usage du sol: politique foncière et zones de développement dans le Canton de Genève
Vinh Dao, Directeur de la planification et des opérations foncières, Etat de Genève
Feb. 27, 2020 · 4:10 p.m.
488 views
Land (and soil?) management in the Flemish fringe around Brussels
Luc Van der Elst, program coordinator and project manager, Vlaamse Landmaatschappij
Feb. 27, 2020 · 4:40 p.m.
124 views
