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ask you yes or no question
oh we squeeze no i focus more yes or no
no no no yes excellent okay so a lot let's hear what you have to say
you know the says this question is uh what you tried once a uh everyday at when it comes to uh
to motor racing and where do you put the line between uh like getting the sports a safe enough
uh and i think we we we try to answer that question was first with a vision of all president on thought
uh he believes we believes that you can actually do moderating without having any fatalities at the end of the go
uh and therefore if you if you deal for that as you of each and you need to do number off thing or not
here you'll pass on on what you should be doing to get to a fully always with
the fatalities now we we feel okay about that because uh there is nothing we do
is that is here to ah have less accidents we like everybody we envoy as a fun
having the accident and the actions and so it's it's okay to have an accident
as long as no one answered is that which is that's that's exactly right that's exactly right we uh we we do leave it
these aspect of the spot because it's part of the spots but what we want to see happening at when the accident
as happened on the dice to walk away and to go home uh we don't want the the bad consequences of that
so that's how we try to balance as these two season then perhaps another way for was
certainly to it to look at it is that when something really bad happened um
do we think at that moment does a society does you guys do you guys think at that moment that it's okay to
continue like that all we as a society will ask for
safety step at that moment and leaves that the also
is it a better to do it before hand and then after all so again yes or no do you think
you have a balance right or always squeezing of another sport i think we have a balance okay great um
alright uh the heart lab um two is there a
like a a warning before anyone goes in
ah well if it is not meant to be a it's the
human injury research regenerate technologies laboratory purdue in an uh
we started off looking at almost you scale for injuries ankles knees shoulders that kind of thing
actual last ten years we've been doing um brain injury research
and what we found um i think is is
we aren't even close to to protecting uh especially use
well enough and uh um but it doesn't
it doesn't have to take any of the excitement out of the game there's
so many things you can do if you understand and you process better
to protected without going into it to big rule changes or or things that would affect
the sport dramatically and uh and i think a lot of releasing american football um
people focus on the brutality of it and and even coaches coach to the brutality of it but really
what the game is supposed to be user three or four second chess match on every play
it's i think part of it is if proper understanding of what's the word is meant
to be arm and it's not meant to be brutal it's meant to be uh
engaging exciting you know quick decision making that kind of thing that that i think is is
we often mistake for for work okay we'll come back to those issues later but
again the yes or no question do you think we have it right in sport in general not yeah we're not yeah
right okay great i'm much too same question are we squeezing the life and of another sport do you think
i i really don't don't think so no that's it for the moment that and for for show we are here to to discuss about the
how to manage the the the best thing uh with uh all those topics
i think there is too many um different level and evil of of
of the the the level of uh of that thing it says the ages
the uh if we go that they want to to if they want to compete adjusts to also for fun
i think there is a if we have to to understand all these levels maybe we can manage more the risk and to
to focus on the right population we know that any player players who uh we take risks
ah but maybe some actually don't want takes too much weeks
so i don't know if in our rules in now in all the
type of sports we have all this this different um level of
of management right yes or no do you think we have a bounce right at the moment gentle and sport
for the moment i say i would say no you say no right okay a great uh same questioning macho
well as you know i'm the black sheep here so um well i'm working that title being and the uh and
the goal of entitled thing is to protect rubber than to accept
the risk that the actors can take my taking building substance
this is also protecting the spirit of sport or the integrity of sport and it's um
all the moment i think we don't do enough in that direction right okay great so your answer would be
no them that the question okay so let's try and break this uh this down a little bit um
whose should be making the decision as to what is acceptable in terms of
risk in sport let's just talk about the elite level to start with
we should be taking the decision as to what is acceptable should be the administrators
should be the the players should be parents families and friends the entourage
should it be the media uh should it be the fans
um it should be people come becomes like this um who do you think should be taking the
decision as to where the where to draw who i'm in terms of risk and protection
um so since we want to be informal anyone want to jump in rather than going down the line
yeah if it's okay um i was i was gonna say i think you should be the healthcare professional
um the down side of that is that the the way most of these teams are organised the healthcare
professionals answer to the coach or to the to the general manager and i think that's a problem
and i think they're that structure needs to go outside of the of the coaching uh assignment
and uh and the health care professions also need more data more
a better understanding of what injuries really are and having progress
and then i think you've got a good a good group they can manage the the level of of potential injury
right i think you're in the anyway solutions gonna be foreign does it add that that might act as the
p. apply as the governing bodies on the medical community and sandwiches tighter than i and i think
essentially boils down to question of free choice and i think you know to make
that choice that but it's applied to the schools players need to have the
medical evidence on which the the the risky sex these night and they also need to know
that the governing bodies doing what i can to and then use whatever rules are
necessary to actually began completely plight eyesight is it can be that altering its fundamental character
and then unless you got those reactors in a room might knows decisions and
it's it's actually sets in the the bar on its and i i don't think we're going to get from that
for a proper solution to it so you saying that it's a matter who's involved
at the end of the day it's the player who's gonna make the
decision as to whether they take part now and there has to be right
i think that has buttons apply yeah and makes a choice and
sports you hope existing free sites but people are free to choose to take part on else and
unexpected fully knows individuals but the basics exciting and and said yes you know that
it's at the ritz yeah i think that's the position from other sport
yeah i think i think it's uh it's also relate to us um if if you look at the big
picture i think the committee to society statues where we are going we we used to have a a
in model sport a lot of fatalities every weekend so it years ago it was perfectly okay
have also good ending body we're doing a lot less about safety compared to now
but if we had now anyway across the number of fatalities we had that these days
uh the spots was stopping two years three years and therefore i think the society um
send some very powerful signals these days and as a given governing body we try to interpret
exams to anticipate them and and to make sure that we are a a step ahead
but you also have the situation we might have a very vocal small minority group
who want to see certain changes uh they make a lot of no
is um does that have too much influence on the governing
bodies decision you think i i think um it is down to the strains of the governing body in these conditions you
know we we are in the in you know well the way uh anybody can say whatever way you want some get massive
exposure and i think it's down to a again your own understanding of what the society's be to accept for the sport
and you are understanding of what the vision uh what these and you have all the spot which
is back to the first one i don't know if you have that you can be
a a strong enough when when the wrong voices ah ah becoming a bit too loud loud
however i will i will certainly uh agree with leon that eating out the the most powerful voice on for the right
reasons i'll get it also bothers for us yeah but looking at it from the from the medical side um
an athlete wants to perform an athlete wants to win and they won't necessarily
pay attention to what is best for them as a result of that
from looking at it from the medical point of view how do you think that
you can mm intervene or take part in the debate to make sure that
well they not only understand the risks better prepared to act on them properly for their um health and safety
either straight way or else down the line once they've retired mm it's funny
the main words indication indication of athletes indication of everybody uh on that
uh south is the beginning the sports you have to know the the risk you
have to know uh onto in how to lose a and uh uh
i think maybe we as coaches coach electoral maybe there is no not
over the the there's a good a message i don't know
but i think as as a a medical providers other
are real well on that's also in this application
maybe not on him on considerations because if that's it yeah isn't
good has you won't go to the to the medical doctor
but maybe in in you as a a social made yeah
i knew a new maybe i don't know uh to
to to focus on on prevention for as a prevention is a it is a a nine point out of that
and i'll i'll for me uh it it's a collaborative project
to okay uh as medical and scientific uh i
uh i'm messed up to to evaluate into the no uh uh to to know better as
a result but it's a quality projects and it is even if a minute disciplinary project
into work also with attitudes with them to see what oh i located think this basic
okay uh and yeah you all where are you are really aware of that right
or maybe on the anti dumping fronts um there are two issues one
is the one that you raised earlier which is about cheating
uh it's cheating you wanna have a level playing field it's unfair of someone take something that gives an advantage
but the other side is also the health issues that you don't know what's
going to happen to your body if you take inject substances yes um
how do you get that message across to the athletes one again all they wanna do is when and we've seen
time and time again they're prepared to take the rest even though they know that they're potentially downsides later on
well you know how does this is very difficult
um we need to incorporate also with the physicians than those sports physicians all the team physicians
we discuss a lot with the team physician with the cultures we have uh with the athletes
um of course they are pushed by this sports community
to perform well into it say to win medals
at almost any price um the messages for us
for anti dumping is very difficult to transmit
on the health issues because i think really this is the
role of the medical doctors in the other physicians so
what my experience it's really the question of respectable rules
long cheating integrity of support and services receive a message which okay
um let's say hello to diminish the race by saying well
at the end it will be better for your health but first you have just to follow the rule
there is no competition without too and uh i'm sure that you know if
you you have the possibility to to take a pill which will
give you a a gold medal you will take at even if you are
speaking about the health and what will happen when twenty years from now
if you are speaking about the rules and uh and that you
are cheating i think every every athlete cannot this and that
okay i follow up on that instrument ah the uh i i think one of the important
things for the physicians used to used to not be reactionary so i think i think
what often happens is if you get a knee injury and then you start trying to to
intervene after that you you can open the door to to all kinds of of
um how do you say well the potential for drug use a
a performs as resources are more likely at that point
um but you also get into the situation where um you're really having people as opposed to preparing them so
one of the things that that jumped out at us when we started looking at me injuries is
there's all these different techniques for re having knee injuries and uh you tear your
e. c. on when you go through this program to to balance your your
uh like muscles and and you always see why are we doing that before while we
wait until the knee injury happens go ahead and and and would really like
to see and and and this is based on our research and all the things
we've learned so far is that we'd like to get to these clinicians involved
way before the injury happens and then i think you end up
with a higher performing athlete and and people are saying
oh prevention is better than shows what absolutely but yet if you really have to get to the point where there's
you know that that medical staff probably has to be three or four times larger
than it is right and and that's the investment that i think is crucial
so i'm coming back to risk verses entertainment what's called um
other way is um where we can reduce risk without reducing the
entertainment value uh other technological solutions perhaps the can help
without a doubt yeah i mean in the head injury side of things um
i mean we see how graphic changes in brain function even without symptoms
um and we see that when symptoms resolve your brain is
still quite different than than it was before the injury
um but having said that the helmets are out there right now are
not are not nearly as effective as they could be um very very
small easy innovations will will dramatically reduce the managers and soccer
uh you let a little air out of a bone you decrease the the peak forces on the head by twenty five percent
so we we shown which you can actually make the sports relatively safe you know
it doesn't it doesn't have to be like that for for ankle injuries
start making me he on the basketball shoes so tall just widen
widen the base a little bit you'll have your ankle injuries
it's very simple stuff to come down right okay so one tip
there if you play football or soccer for american friends
uh don't over inflate the ball uh and uh you can reduce concussion and um
again looking at things you can do to make sport safer without taking away the entertainment value
for mother's what you said thirty years ago lots of deaths and injuries now
cut way down what did you do what with the steps that were taken to make it safer while still keeping it entertaining
i'm getting the fan base there so so i think i at first i don't think there is anything we do hopefully
uh reduce the entertainment level uh for the reasons we we discussed earlier so hopefully
everything he's only for safety with without coming at the possible the shop
uh exactly somebody like to see uh people lying on the track but hopefully that's not the case uh so what
has been done and we will go through that actually at this afternoon it during during the presentations ease
ease mainly safety research in in or are we as from engineering to medical
um the um the feeling for those was was huge in them up and
the technology that has improved dramatically income of clash that's for the cost
into um off protecting the neck of the draw those and and all these
things put together i'll of made i'll i'll fatality numbers dropped a dramatically
uh but it was completely innovation driven and completely researched even so it's a it's a very uh
it's a very engineering and medical data driven approach that took us um that to that result right
in rugby um uh one of the issues always was the scroll arm and
you know where the uh the two teams come together like that
um which could cause a neck injuries another another problems thank you very much um
um it's um this one was a been changed over the years to try
make it's safer when explaining the evolution and also what's been the reaction
'cause some people thought for instance the hits when they used to come together violently was taken out
of the game some people thought before happening that it would make the game less exciting
but what's been the result has in the reverse is true to be honest and
i think the yet you might have screen completions is much higher because
essentially be the referee will get sick of resets in the school maybe just can't get kind of resigned
so and we actually is reason to believe that actually v.
b. innovations like again cipher balcony mike moritz tiny i
think what what would say just the guy go easy to line up to tackle comes down at the moment
you are not prohibitive intact legal people say the line of shoulders if we see the the the area
the legionnaire exactly will dance whites level that will free the plans on them to get the ball like which ultimately
what is it that side's what's happening to double not into the pliers and then eat if those changes
keep c. right now i think we will say i load sack align a low rates of injury and then on a better guy
not not not uh what's one so you and i don't think
there's recently next everything yeah changing that they did that
possibly night should be guy and on the grounds that it'll be less it's tiny water but sexual or um
then coming back to the antidote being one of the most um
thrilling races of all time was that hundred meters final
um the ben johnson final where everyone um uh well most of most
of them or or or some sort of a enhancement program um
do you think that it's um
it's important assassin earlier session um should we say hey take whatever you
like doesn't matter what you think it's important that we do have
the anti dumping rules that we have in place for the safety of the of the athletes
yeah i i remember the time because i'm getting older and older is
i remember the time and this that was a fantastic final
i was you know my here all was the colour with at the time so i was
a bit sad that the the final was fantastic and uh you can wander the yeah
well would you be able to see l. same kind of final without building and uh
of course for me the answer is yes it means this question is coming always
inciting for example nobody will look to watch too too but
all the false uh without a verse first am uh
uh we're not building a and this is wrong you know is is wrong because when you look at the television
you don't know exactly at what speed they are hiking the mountains or these kind
of things uh the same question fall they a hundred meters it means
what is exciting the public is not only that the world record is being beat it
is to see a nice little a nice fights between the eight people the line
my point of view um it's very important to continue the fight against opening
if it'll ben johnson was it was almost like a body builder so he
was taking a huge tools of of um another it's there it's um
you know that it was there an american sprinter one also uh for the woman at that time she died
some years after the at and it's clear that if
you open again to everyone any kind of building
you will have many and many of these athletes will just thought is is here
still today it's difficult to to have this message
because because we know today that we have
a minimum of control of what is taken and uh today it would be
impossible to take as high dosages ben johnson was taking its toll today
is not so detrimental to be held but if you open the gate everyone
would come to higher and higher those that the competition will be
on the number of pills and what's really on the string to yet
on the on the medical side what you think um i don't
know if you think in percentages uh up what would be
do you think unacceptable levels say in football with your chances is two percent of having an a. c. l.
uh injury over a ten year career or four percent chance if there's some way of changing rules
to bring the percentage down what would you say would be an acceptable level of the chance
of an injury or is that impossible to compute i i think
it's very difficult to put 'em of course or really
and to to say uh which one is really acceptable the less is the the is a better with uh
again i think there is there is there in the a different level of of
management in different level of of type of um of message to to put
how to prevent own injuries i think its input seemed impossible to prevent everything for sure uh uh
accepted those is uh is the word uh with different uh
uh i defend gay kind of uh an hour everybody
uh i was uh own course of acceptability
so i i i don't think a one person asked to to choose that we we
uh again with everybody have to uh to put on the table and say okay well well
oh to to decrease the risk uh at the minimum and don't talk
about it uh and number but at the minimum for everybody right
and i and i don't think the two percent four percent maybe use is
quite a fair comparison because when produce started as women's soccer team um
every single player on the team had an a. c. l. reconstruction so they're all in high
school they are all torn mary c. l.'s and uh and so our our perspective is
you know we need to get that down to divide your like a one in ten kind of thing uh yourself
when we get to the to four percent then yes absolutely we could have that debate i think work
right now especially in women's sports we're at at it and on acceptably high well
or it so do you think why they're more entries in women's sports women's
that's a question that people been actually for a long time and
uh uh unfortunately we're not very close to to answering
that but uh um but when we started doing head injury research you know we looked at the football players
we saw a couple players go to a two hundred g. had impacts just unbelievable
um and i kinda chauvinist if we thought when we got into women's soccer that it would be nearly as bad um but
then we watch your some goal kicks go across have feel may
have them back and we read hundred hundred twenty g.'s
the distribution of head impacts was almost identical between
a collegiate women's soccer and football american football answer i just uh uh
we we we don't really even understand the injury process well enough to to make that state okay
right um so before we throw it open to questions um like to get a little bit controversial
uh and speaking as individuals and not representatives of your uh of various organisations
so far we've talked about sports where there's a risk of getting injured but not
about sports where the object of the sport is to hurt the other person
um so do you think that sports where the object is to hurt the other person searches boxing
or mixed martial arts whatever might be is not acceptable should that be about do you think
i mean we done away with gladiators him we've done away with public hangings and things like
that so the the moral uh temperatures changed a lot over the last couple hundred years
um do you think there's still room for sports with the aim is to hurt the other person
i think they have to pay and that lets people who wants
to an inbuilt genie sports of that nature and because
baseball's when i speak only going to be done is that the native that harm reduction and having
i legal and regulated by says fulton is by far the best ally to go back to
the need that's excellent or yeah i i guess if you had here um
somebody from the governing body of of these federations that will that will probably
a look at it as i'm doing what they can't you um
estimate the basic and and and get the based on the on the small that that improve the spoils you off to go
um and and i guess society will accept that today uh and and probably for quite a few years or
it's very good question i i think you could get boxing to down
to an acceptable level of risk with with some some changes
um but i don't think you should you should encourage things like m.
m. a. as as a sport when it when it's uh uh
it is more right we considered violent i think right that's my project but you
i think it is there is people who want to to to
see but boxing and went to the to play the boxing
and all that kind of support will uh we we can't uh uh stop that we just
have to to find a good way to to do it as a less risky level
uh we we want saying that we want and the and maybe there will be new
sports in india near and with whiskey sports and we we so that uh yeah
uh with extreme sport like there i think question and and
the way we have to accept into control that's an again everybody have to
to discuss about the the risk and but only the expert mm macho well yeah
channel only repeat uh what was already said it's a question of risk management and uh i can
understand that some people like to do is tennis or a room that's here of course
building could be trained then there's the danger is it means
uh you change the rules with building in these days
if you open the door a complicated to build things substances
the to to either but it's there it's i think
it will be a very bad reason that are these dates right interesting so no
abolitionists here um right does anyone have any questions they'd like to ask
got the uh topic you'd hear ready to go and wants to uh
oh there we go
thank you she that um thanks for about idle it's it's a fascinating topic i wanted to ask the question actually
um because if we look at the recent history l. and i think the same as that could be separately
the big it is one of the great attractions stole an l. c. d. is a big it's what makes sense now
the direction of travel to sort of a climate change if you like in sports is
that that is perceived to be dangerous detrimental health so do you have to accept
the one of the major uh appeals to a time of rock a we'll have
to get one that is the big ultimately dangerous but right to watch it
i sat lady yep i think he yeah we're which surgery he
is ease ease in policy it has to be lois and
it's a style but i think to maintain the heights of the jacket occurred highlights i
need to be brought down to something more light the abdomen slash whites level
uh and and you'll still say these fantastic tackles that said and
also layout side is any school that ease is night but
made if i if it will be spent nights i said the highlights of the tackle
has to be brought down as a matter of little not just the matter of an abstraction and because at
the moment so check 'cause ah section there is a daily but the reason actually i yeah and
i actually approached lowering the height of the tackle by actually my key and illegal
in in in would be little side and i think there is at a future for the big tackle
but uh and i really if if if the high to be really hard to be
ruled right and i think oh so i got to say i think um
the the end of relatives could learn a lot from right b. um and how quickly they're making changes in adapting
i'm also for motor sports which are kind of the the the paragraph
on for how you how you adapt and and make things safer
um but i also i actually when the media quite a
bit because the the commentators focus on these big hits
and really like i said before the the what that game is supposed to be user three or four second chess match
and i need the the media commentators to to elevate the discussion a
little bit and and bring that into it and hide my
the quick decision making to you um you know what's going through the player's mind when they're deciding whether they're gonna give up the
board keep going those are the kind of things that i need i need the media actually behind um because i uh
i think they they have a a tremendous power to transform at
right thanks very much thanks a question oh unfortunately our time's up um it's
been a fascinating discussion so i'd like to thank all of our panelists
for taking part uh uh
i guess my parting message would be in terms of risk and safety in
and all that and support it's up to you it's really up to i think what they've all said frankly it's up to society
to decide where is the right level and you should take part not to pay in any sport that you're involved with
um so we can make sure that people can have a good time be
entertained but also be as safe as possible so thanks very much

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Conference program

Welcome Words by David Eades
David Eades
15 May 2018 · 9:06 a.m.
Welcome Words by Philippe Leuba
Phillipe Leuba, Chef du Département de l'Economie et du Sport
15 May 2018 · 9:08 a.m.
Welcome Words by Grégoire Junod
Grégoire Junod
15 May 2018 · 9:13 a.m.
Welcome Words by Benoit Mariani
Benoit Mariani
15 May 2018 · 9:15 a.m.
Hacking the Future
Andy Walshe
15 May 2018 · 9:25 a.m.
Talkback Session: Smart Venues, Moderated by David Eades
Daniel Marion, John Rhodes, Claire Lewis
15 May 2018 · 10:18 a.m.
Talkback Session: Wearables and Data, Moderated by David Eades
Terho Lahtinen, Jean-Christophe Longchampt, Christophe Ramstein, Patrick Schoettker
15 May 2018 · 11:04 a.m.
Talkback Session: Fans and Data, Moderated by Rebecca Hopkins
Horesh Ben Shitrit, Pete Burns, David Lampitt, Clemens Schnellert
15 May 2018 · 11:46 a.m.
Interviews, Moderated by David Eades
Stéphane Guerry, Joey Tan, Olivier Glauser, Albert Mundet
15 May 2018 · 1:45 p.m.
Talkback Session: Machine Learning and AI, Moderated by Jay Stuart
Nicolas Chapart, Nicolas Déal, Johan Vounckx, Mehrsan Javan
15 May 2018 · 2:37 p.m.
Speech
Jochen Färber
15 May 2018 · 3:14 p.m.
Talkback Session: NextGen Video & Engagement, Moderated by Nicolas Henchoz
Christoph Heimes, Spencer Nolan, Pedro Presa, Alexandra Willis
15 May 2018 · 3:30 p.m.
Interview on Security
Earl Crane
15 May 2018 · 4:08 p.m.
Talkback Session: Cyber security and Digital Security, Moderated by Sébastien Kulling
Dang Duy, Thomas Shorrock, Jean-Pierre Hubaux, Simon Trudelle
15 May 2018 · 4:19 p.m.
Introduction of Day 2
David Eades
16 May 2018 · 9:35 a.m.
Social Business and Sport
Muhammad Yunus
16 May 2018 · 9:38 a.m.
Talkback Session: Designer Bodies - Yes or No? Moderated by David Eades
Roland Sigrist, Vincent Gremeaux, Carlos Canto Alvarez, Véronique Lugrin
16 May 2018 · 10:27 a.m.
Talkback Session: Designing for the Future, Moderated by Jay Stuart
Ali Russell, Emilio Risques, Véronique Michaud, Thilo Alex Brunner
16 May 2018 · 11:08 a.m.
Talkback Session: Protection through Innovation, Moderated by Mike Miller
Liam Mc Tiernan, Laurent Mekies, Eric Nauman, Martial Saugy, Mathieu Saubade
16 May 2018 · 12:04 p.m.
From Racing to the Road
Laurent Mekies
16 May 2018 · 1:32 p.m.
Talkback Session: Understanding the eSports Ecosystem, Moderated by Jay Stuart
Brent Barry, Anna Baumann, Julien Delalande, Michael Journot, Carlos "ocelote" Rodriguez Santiago
16 May 2018 · 2:05 p.m.
Talkback Session: What's next in eSports? Moderated by Lars Stegelmann
Brett Abarbanel, Stefan Kuerten, Jan Pommer, Federico Winer
16 May 2018 · 3:05 p.m.
Closing Words
David Eades
16 May 2018 · 4:06 p.m.

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