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Gabriel Clerc, Head of TTO
Gabriel Clerc
Tuesday, Nov. 13, 2018 · 6:20 p.m. · 31m 11s
Gabriel Clerc is a mechanical engineer from the EPFL with a specialization in applied thermodynamics and turbo-machinery. In 1988, he joined the EPFL research directorate as a staff member and became Head of the Technology Transfer Office (EPFL-TTO) from its creation in 1998 until 2018. Presently, he is a senior advisor at the Presidency of EPFL, mainly for IP and TT matters. Having spent nine years active in the field of aeronautics as an experimental test pilot for the Swiss department of defense, he also works as an R&D engineer for SULZER Co. central R&D department. He also co-founded and was president of the Swiss Technology Transfer Association (swiTT). He is a member of AUTM and ASTP associations. The EPFL-TTO is protecting, managing and licensing EPFL intellectual property. It is responsible to negotiate and approve collaboration agreements with industrial partners. The TTO also manages the relations between EPFL and its numerous start-up/spin-out companies.
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hi thank you very much only uh this is the subject of my
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talk so uh i would like first to congratulate uh oh
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for for his presentation that was very impressed you press that since you're you're not no
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sensors and a well for my coverage of it usually that was really nice
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so yeah i want to present through why and how i came here to the
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basically i was a bit pushed by l. a. and jodie
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uh at the time where i was a story thinking of uh every time
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and uh they pushed made to was a starter champions and i thought what what it is uh
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i am not the startup i'm not the empire put uh oh okay i think that the transfer
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so finally i said yes let's try it but i didn't know that uh
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it was a challenge and it is a challenge for me today to interest through to this matter
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i hope you learn something however i think for our startups
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the phase at tech transfer is also very important so
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maybe your little something out of that experience
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so trying in shorts to define what these tech transfer
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uh there are many many ways to define it i choose
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are a bit an original way today which he's people
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and we're also
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for actions so you would tell me there are many many
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activities around us that are exactly the same let me
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put it the uh the d. which people they talk a lot and finally they hope to make actions that
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now here in tech transfer the actions that's exactly what's on sociology that
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the the action finally is to blame smart i use really to reality
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to bring new product on the market to bring new therapies news services et cetera
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the idea is really finally it to have the benefit also cited
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in terms of economic value but also so sit at that
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so this is my definition today of tech transfer and of course there are different players they're
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the researchers the t. t. o. the company that pop up that handle along this line
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so people first people this is the most important part uh of course
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as a tech transfer of peace and managers we are collaborating we
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are partnering we are discussing with many many different uh people
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you see here a list and a non extremely stand and uh with a few
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see you can say we the from the scientific by ah but also from
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the business part so mentors lawyers it said uh so many people
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so it is of course an essential ah it's the people is an essential
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part the most important for the success of any tech transfer and bench
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i just remember the uh the danielle well it the last uh
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a meeting it e. p. f. l. for the usual energy style when he started he's he's speech
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saying it is about people people in the end i think that's really the most important one
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so the first lesson that we have to take with us
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especially for the people involved in tech transfer not only that
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that tries to managers but also from the startup c.
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this is the least i can keep i can give you a in
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short the important is to keep these best relation we'd be
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we need to ask questions and also listen to beep
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we have to learn from the other p. we have not the truth on
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or every see we need also between for many explain many things
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it's very important of course we negotiate or sell finally we want a
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dinner we want something that the easy these useful for the future
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but also enjoy diversity of the p. there are so many different be paid young
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not so young and in the different nationalities different background it is really something to
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enjoy and of course there is a need to respect them on the people
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so this is a very important set of lessons that uh
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everybody should stay calm when dealing with these it's things
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about the words of course it's always about words in many things when you speak
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so this is a few words that i put there
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some of you may recognise some of them some of them are not so uh uh
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easy to understand some of them i knew a token for example
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uh some of them are very legal and stuff like that so we are dealing with
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words or so many words exchange in return during a tech transfer process but
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very often these words may have long term impact
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so it is important for example in
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patents the wording it but i think is important it's finally what you put
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in contract the wording you you lose you saw him all that well it is a long term relationship
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we have different commitments that we right so we we agree these
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the walls within these documents as you call it it is one side
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of our probation to make sure that we do it right
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there are many other words that we change during the tech transfer process you see that misty
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of course scientific staff in shade information business
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ideas and plans you can wear it
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beings regulations and walls even teaching we do
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some teaching all these these words
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of course finally there is also a lot of data send any rules and say we have to begin with it's okay
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this is an example
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this is a small uh uh they you cared small robot
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and you see the first claim of these patent
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it's just one sentence with one hundred and twenty seven words
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i mean it is not easy to understand what they're but it is our
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goal to look at that to try to understand and then make
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but feeble best decisions with the scientists thinning the inventors
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you have the right wording for the planes but finally
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if this patent these challenge it's exactly these
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worthy and then well the commas are and where the things are that will be discussed
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so not so easy always this is another example that i took from the contract
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which is one calls which one hundred and twenty nine words
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probably you can imagine that this company that make this contract with us was a us company of course
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but you know all that to understand what is behind that you need to go deep into it try to
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understand try to explain to the process so that we
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signed the contract uh what what it is uh
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and that's that's a it's yours she is uh not uh quite a lot
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of pressure on on the people to to really understand what's going on
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a key element of our work as the transfer managers is
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to clarify situations before uh we transferred unless it's
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it is very important for every project with a clear situation otherwise
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you will maybe it's difficult to to uh to find investors
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or you will have a problem with your license or u. i. p. later
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so chi phi situation means identification of the i.
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p. who is the owner we have
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string at that age do we have to write protection for this i. p.
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uh that's that's that the that the company needs background i. p. e. from the from the lad
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a a do we need to reserve spirit then writes for the lab
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for further research we don't want to stop the research unit that
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after having signed a contract do we have any export issues with
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this technology you do we have it figured a bit
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issue there so there are many many situation that we need to pry
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find that the job of the tech transfer or fees to
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really go there finally to create clear combat contracts
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that really are understandable and very precise on the
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different not those that are under the contract
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so this huge finally the best chance for for the development
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and investment the technology out of the scientific ways
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you know that's scientific research today is more more collaborative
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more aboard may jointly with other institution it makes
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the work it take transfer or even one more difficult but this is an important uh uh and
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now uh i wanted initially to present to a few cases
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a few stories of uh of tech transfer finally
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i did renounce it for the time reason on one side and also
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i realised that every projects is important for
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the one that part behind each which
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so why i put one project in front over the other it's
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for me very difficult has been project with trailers but we
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are so important for the inventors and for the entrepreneurs and
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our big successes they are also very important for them
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so i'd i'd to renounce too much to mention specific cases
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just i respect to all these commitments that way behind these hundreds
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of project that we had been followed with that twenty years
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so i give you a rough numbers uh uh uh what we have done over the years
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this is one set of numbers you see two thousand invention disclosure is
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twelve hundred priority patent applications granted patents close to one thousand
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nine hundred license agreements each of one of these were contract which it to be
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clear and approved by everybody and sign finally
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three hundred startups with the years
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a research agreements for t. t. also handle research agreement namely with industry
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about five thousand of these agreements were handled by my of fees
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for the approximately one billion swiss francs of funding
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important also the contact with the people and so uh i try to figure out
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and here i i came weighs about two thousand eight hundred different inventors
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so we have inventors that invent many many different things so
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i just counting to one so these are different persons
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two thousand eight hundred quite a lot and they came out of three hundred different laps and research groups
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so a lot of the the and you can imagine behind that a lot of words
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this is an old slack
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just history
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a matter of fact it was not a slide it was but transparency
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at that time we did not help out
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we did print transparencies and present them uh to the
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audience and at that time i uh we
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had programs we had already computers to put that in a nice we had also laser printers
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but i realised that the document i did found a a
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on that knoll program was able to open it
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it was impossible to open that okay so i had to
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scan a a transparency that at detecting my ah chi
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so this is a a sort of initial way that we do so it's in french
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uh this presentation was for the uh government the ball a course i data
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and uh this was a mini survey that we did
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at that time i don't put the date now
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uh and we got our answer from nineteen entrepreneur
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and we asked them what are the biggest parts that is to create a company
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in your shop cycle one was financing the start of the company
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and also it's initial development the second what the market
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no the market and access to mac and the first obstacle that
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with the lack of professional coaching for defining a reasonable strategy at the con
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what are your gash was then the slide and what you're
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any suggestion
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so
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nine ninety seven was presented that slide i i i i
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don't know if we make such a survey today
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which will be the order of these obstacle of the the ah new groups like
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i would think that this was quite still uh i got it and
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and probably the big difference of today today we the slide will be in english
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why why the community was small at that time
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and it became larger and larger and larger
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with many people from different arise and and we are very happy to it
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international uh uh a p. h. d. students that created startup
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so the whole community was ease now much much much
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now the the slide just after it will this one so this
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was the e. p. f. l. policy and measures to
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uh it's you bought innovation at that time it's also ninety
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seven that same same slide so you see finally
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it's not that bad as a strategy and i think what is important is that we did it
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basically it was not only on the paper but we did it and it probably
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uh many today is uh the initiatives india courses then uh the paper and
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i have the original days at that time when we really started all these things
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now maybe the most important slide if it's the lessons from my point of view
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uh about tech transfer how to make successful relations with
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the economy and tech transfer a full universe
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so i i do present the seven points regularly too
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uh international delegations coming to weep yet but and and looking at what we're doing in tech transfer
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and today i said my said i will present these here in switzerland
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for you for it's a general uh a set of points
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first point for me very important is the oh
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tommy that we give to the institutions
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the higher authorities should not impose to details regulations involved
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only general principle should be there and there should be a clear trust to
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the institutions i think it is a strengths in switzerland that we had
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these autonomy a biggie th for example you get thirty th
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through the u. t. h. role of ninety three and i think
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if we keep that going that will be good for tech transfer in creation of value
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unfortunately today we see more and more and more controlling more and more and more already
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it's and and unfortunately this is not going the right direction from my point
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the collaboration with industry and that that transfer should be recognised in it
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as one of the important mission of institution that's a very important
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uh element it should not be just for publication
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of uh of success shoes and and uh
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uh it should be really recognise in one one of the important mission of course is
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not research is not an education but it fused an important mission to also side
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there should be no compromise on quality of research
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the recruitment of the faculty members the professor should be
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at the best level worldwide that's very important
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we see the best tech transfer through the best
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scientists it is a very very important
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the highest management to the institution should involve uh should be involved
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to discuss strategic alliance with partners it is very important
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to have the strategic partnership with the big companies
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and without a strong involvement of the highest management this is not possible
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important is how we structure the decision making and from my point of view in my
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experience the delegation of decision on the level of the to to your face
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is very important to have an efficient tech transfer response if tech transfer
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it is also expected from our partners companies in and start typing creation
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that the responses you squeak inefficient and not going through that
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a big the chain of command we the approvals and the in backwards
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the second point in in here it's also the recruitment of the tech transfer managers
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it's very important and i think having industry
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experience is really really very important
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in order to be credible when we do our work in collaboration these companies and stuff
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a reasonable of our world of lawyers lawyers ah needed they are
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very uh uh well integrated you know we're a team activities however
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we should have acceptance of risk and we should not had the lawyers having the
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last world the last word should be given by the management that the side
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yes we signed this contract with this clause or no we don't sign the school
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so try to have a very good collaboration with the lawyers
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at the the final say at the right place
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and finally the proximity of the t. t. o. b. the research or
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and the faculty members the professors is essential to have a good teamwork
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at the early stage of this collaboration so that we can really make our work together
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so with vision is possible to not being just far away it somewhere in in in the nature
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this is it now i have a small experience
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all this is very nice many words many people may interaction
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when there are so many people to do is and when there are so many words to master
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it is necessary for each of us to compensate
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and also enjoy for example art and nature
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and in particular to the i would like to invite you
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to listen to the side
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how we can do that very easy
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i will present you it's a future it's a video
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we will lower the last eight
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i need your silent and there's only about
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fifty sect
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ready
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i
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is
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oh
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'kay
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oh oh oh oh oh
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'cause
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i
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hi
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how just a comment i think it's important to have this that it's
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and uh i'm happy that moist said that once a month lease that act like
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uh it is also important to wear these patterns personally to also enjoy it
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other things than just talking and and trying to to find solutions
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i just want to start to rise to uh have a last slide to thank the pen i want to thank here
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all the many people i i worked with over the years papas so researchers
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in just lead to steal start uppers cody each it's it yeah
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cannot name all of them is supported us and the encourage us to
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to continue on and to to make it uh even always a bit to work
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in particular uh i want to uh to think about for president that we're doing
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this period the lobby total put but do not take evasion nothing italy
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the the the first also important in support
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also we're directors and he'd be using java about what he would like to
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thank them very much and in particular mentioned product but then the
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was really option here in these to you with a clear vision
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and who launched many of these important initiatives we try really uh
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yeah uh which are with the the base of today's uh reach very reach a good system we actually
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of course the t. t. o. t. m. also uh ex members of
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the team i would like to thank them for their commitment
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and and in some collaboration and finally last doesn't it's least would
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like to thank very much possible my wife with here
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all the background work she did the family and also the
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extremely invaluable should all that she gave me over all
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these very intensely years thank you very much
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i would like to wish also the best want equity knee is also here today
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and he took over the lead of the g. d. o. and he would hit a
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habit uh really much sixty with it in we should just this isn't how
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don't go too far your retirement not yet here yeah no we won't let you go
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um we said would have up our discussion our part with water i would like
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to call more it sounded to call gabrielle of course to join us
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um and uh to have everyone altogether before we let you go
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uh as more discussion to be able to pay questions of course from the audience and there
00:26:17
are several questions which were already asked onto the the slide replication thank you very much
00:26:22
so i think we have here um and we were a birds eye ready
00:26:26
before for later uh what will be the rest of the upper or
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so you do have possibly have mike's of course uh on the
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table please take a seat um have a a lexus
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your without one mike too many but will are using for the audience and
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um i well i would probably go there are there are many
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many ah questions were coming uh many of them of course on some
00:26:50
of the things you've said more it's about a running the company
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um one thing that hasn't been no you beating you both i would say uh
00:26:58
that makes a common point of course use you mention words i peak
00:27:01
one of the question that uh came up and i think is relevant for both
00:27:05
so you was a sort of the the us age of these i mean
00:27:09
strategically in the business so how you've seen need the big news i would say a prayer
00:27:13
your questions of how you do you know if you ever had to use all of
00:27:16
you worked out the the patterns uh for your i. p. five store for anything to
00:27:22
define your business so i don't know who wants to be taking this first questions
00:27:26
and then we have many questions coming up uh on top for everyone of course with the questions in your audience
00:27:30
but don't hesitate to use lie do i would try to regroup but that would be my first question
00:27:36
okay i can as most said i p. is probably very important especially for
00:27:42
start up a i. e. t.'s also kind sometime of an illusion
00:27:49
well to defend the position of i. p. in
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reality it's a very very costly advantage
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so uh it is important to have it to be able
00:28:02
to make a partnership but to me to change license to cross license
00:28:08
but to really defend the position for startup it's a very difficult a
00:28:12
task however it's important to protect correctly your i. p. but
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it is also important to be reasonable and to really protect the one
00:28:23
that are really something better you and this is the difficulty to
00:28:30
you have to do that early and you don't really know what will be the future way but uh this is uh
00:28:37
something that the company and and would sweep yeah for this to be a yes i fully agree on
00:28:44
that that's very often difficult to understand what later on it will be important on patents or null
00:28:50
but the channel what we do we say we ride patents if it's something which can be reverse engineered easily
00:28:56
so it means somebody can look at our product understands income
00:29:00
copied but it also means if somebody brings is it
00:29:04
we can look can can prove that thing printed that's very important and put the rest we keep just secret
00:29:10
um because that's much better protection because if you rightly depend everybody's easy to
00:29:16
and um and notice that try to find little ways to get around
00:29:21
so it's really if it can be understood we write patents otherwise it secret
00:29:26
and we needed we had actually you know we had two cases it's competitors would infringe japan when we
00:29:32
finally got an agreement this number to pay money and then they call out of it actually
00:29:36
that was okay um but you know in some case you also see the huge companies that just sometimes just to not care
00:29:43
about the specially mobile market but just say ignore it and the torque upon them you have to be aware of that
00:29:50
or maybe just a comment there is a big difference
00:29:55
as you can imagine for company and for university a company can
00:30:00
decide to keep secret some key elements and not patent
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we cannot do that in university we have to partition we publish and we teach
00:30:10
so when there is a good idea or the patent is a way to protect it
00:30:15
but protecting know how in the university he's almost impossible
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and it's not designed it and maybe want remark you know a good idea in the patent
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just assist or upset making something successful it's a little long
00:30:30
hard way to make up a good idea could product
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and very often it's aware estimate at the beginning oh i have a patent you
00:30:36
know with style no it's not all have to make it successful later on
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oh okay what's next yeah so there are there are many many questions i'd like to to i could i would order them the following there are many
00:30:48
questions about the starting about the you mentioned at some point to restrict to
00:30:52
the company around fifty people so i would try to group them
00:30:55
and uh after they come around a pressure and how did
00:30:58
you run through the difference that and i think it's
00:31:01
very for both of you so maybe just coming back i think i that's a question for more it's um
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